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2G No brakes after gsx upgrade

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Araesk

Proven Member
188
1
Jul 10, 2013
Muskego, Wisconsin
I finally got my car streetable after swapping the engine, and everything worked great and 100% including the brakes. The next day the opportunity came up to grab GSX rotors and calipers, so I jumped on it, and spent 4 hours hammering away to get the old rusted OEM GST rotors off. I even replaced the whole wheel bearing in the passenger side to get it off. I threw on the GSX rotor and dual piston caliper, bled the lines, and drove home cause it started to get late out and I was doing it at my buddies house (note just the passenger side was done at this point). On the way home, i realized the brakes were very soft, but I could still stop if I wanted to. I figured it was just not being bled completely.

The next day I spent another 4 hours getting the drivers side replaced with the GSX upgrade. Now I decided I'd bleed the lines for good, so I had a friend hit the pedal 10 times on both the drivers side and the passenger side to make sure there is no chance for air to be in line. Only now, there were no brakes at all on the car. And when I pump the brakes the A/FR jumps to about 18, then quickly comes back down to about 14 and would level at 13.7.

I figured I'd try swapping the brake booster over incase mine went bad, only that didn't do anything. I bled the master cylinder in the car (Opened the valve, had someone hit the brake, then close it, and let the brake up) 3 times on each valve to make sure the master cylinder was good. I then decided I'd try to do the whole car (PR, DR, PF, DF), but I just broke off the bleeder valves in the piston, and when trying to extract them broke my ez outs (damn those things never work). So i just re bled the front again and tried to take it out again. Only there were still no brakes. I have no clue what's going on.

Here's a recap of what I all did:
Bled front brakes over 15 times each side
Bled master Cylinder
Swapped Brake booster
Checked brake booster hose for leaks or the check valve not working

The only thing that I think could have caused a problem when we were swapping the brakes over, is that I may have let the reservoir get emptied out when we took the banjo line off the old piston. If that's the case, would the fact I haven't bled the back two brakes in the car really make it completely in capable to stop? The brakes are very resistant when the car is off, but when it turns out I lose all pressure. I've even tried bleeding with the car on. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!

(Last time the brakes and pistons were used on the old car, they worked fine. The car just sat for about half a year after that before finally being sent over to me so I doubt they'd have gone bad?)
 
How would the master have gotten damaged? And if it was the master that failed, wouldn't there be no resistance when the car is off as well as it being on and running?
 
How would the master have gotten damaged? And if it was the master that failed, wouldn't there be no resistance when the car is off as well as it being on and running?

Well there are only so many things it can be. If you are not getting pressure than you are bleeding the brakes wrong, there is a leak in a line, or the master cylinder is bad. That is about the only options here, there is nothing else to it.
 
Like I said I'm not able to bleed the rears cause the bleeders are broken off in there. So jus the fronts are being bled (I know for sure properly). The level in the reservoir does not drop though no matter how long I hit the brakes for car running or not. I'm guessing master cylinder then maybe? Could that really have gotten that damaged from no fluid in the reservoir? Is it possible the pistons might need a rebuild?
 
You need to bleed the rears. If the bleeders are broken than buy new calipers. As for bleeding the front, if the level is not dropping than you aren't bleeding them properly. Is there actually fluid squirting out when you bleed the fronts?
 
The level is dropping when I bleed them and there is fluid squirting amount. I meant when the car is off and all the bleeders are closed, I pump the brakes (car being either on or off) and the fluid level will not drop no matter how many times I do that. But Hm, alright I will go back at it tomorrow and try my luck again at possibly extracting those broken off bits in the rear. Should i do about 4 pumps at each caliper?
 
There really isn't a set number of pumps. Pump it until there is pressure, hold the pedal down, open the bleeder open, close the bleeder than let the pedal up and pump again. Start with the rear than onto the front.
 
The only thing that I think could have caused a problem when we were swapping the brakes over, is that I may have let the reservoir get emptied out when we took the banjo line off the old piston. If that's the case, would the fact I haven't bled the back two brakes in the car really make it completely in capable to stop? The brakes are very resistant when the car is off, but when it turns out I lose all pressure.

If this is the case, this is likely your problem and you'll need to do a thorough bleed at all 4 corners. I would use at least 2-3 big bottles of brake fluid to make sure all the air is out. When the master goes dry, you essentially let air into the entire hydraulic system. There's no vacuum in the brake booster with the engine off, which is why the pedal feels firm but then goes right to the floor with the engine on.

Instead of having someone pump the pedal while you open/close the bleeder, you can also use something like a Mity vac to suck the fluid out.
 
If you let the reservoir drain (empy), you have to bleed all lines no matter what.

This is a good time to clean the lines, bleed the lines completely, let the reservoir to get empy, after that fill it with new oil and start the bleeding process, you will know when the new (clear) oil comes out of the line, do 2,3 pumps more after new oil come out and that line should be good, repet the proses to the rest of the lines, don't forget to clean the inside of the reservoir once is empy so the new oil can last longer (clear).
 
Def recommend using a power bleeder or a hand pump.. makes this process a walk in the park. saves fluid, alot cleaner, and ive always had a better feeling hydraulic system using the power bleeder.. also will clean the entire system and fill everything with good clean fluid!! good luck let us know what happens!
 
Went ahead and picked up a cheap one man brake bleeder kit from harbor and freight. Had someone watch the line to make sure nothing was getting sucked back into the caliper or that any air got in there. Bled two whole cans of 32 oz. dot 3 synthetic brake fluid across all 4 calipers. The fluid was 100% clear at each of the calipers by the time we were half way done bleeding the calipers individually. Did it in the correct order, (Passenger rear, driver rear, passenger front, driver front). Still 0 brakes. I ended up taking it to a local shop and am going to have them diagnose it for me. I am at a loss. The only thing I think it could be would be a crack in the brake lines somewhere?
 
Agreed the rears need bleeding and if they have all been completely bled with absolutely no air bubbles left then the pedal should stiffen up if not then an extensive leak check is needed if all that fails then its for sure the master
 
Turns out that I had the front calipers reversed :ohdamn: went ahead, swapped em, rebled them, and all is 100% great again. Sad how these little things are so overlooked.

Side question to end it, if the clutch doesn't engage after I turn left, that means I have crank walk starting right?
 
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