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Newbie Forum: Beginner/newbie/general DSM modification questions. First mods, how to run 10's when you haven't run 12's yet, any tech question that doesn't fit in another tech forum. Probationary Members must limit their tech posts to this forum and sub-forums.

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Old 05-30-2012, 07:33 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #1 (permalink)
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4g63t head removal


Does it have to be at top dead center?
My timing belt broke, so is it possible to adjust it to tdc without a timing belt on?
also what direction am i turning the crankshaft?

BTW any tips on head removal are welcomed, i looked through a few threads, but im pretty much following haynes


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Old 05-30-2012, 07:59 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #2 (permalink)
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This is the thread that I followed for taking apart my head:

Removing Head Components (1g & 2g)

Also this will help in setting the engine to top dead center:

Timing Belt VFAQ (Timing Belt TSB - ENHANCED)

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Old 05-30-2012, 08:20 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #3 (permalink)
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There really isnt much to it, ok there really is.. If you have any bent or damaged valves which is very possible since the timing belt broke. You dont have to take the turbo or intake manifold off but it does make things easier taking them off since its pretty damn heavy with those on..

So step by step from what I would do..
1) Drain the coolant *you're going to be removing hoses and the thermostat housing anyways so might as well get to this first.
2)remove fans and IC piping
3) Remove turbo * you might as well pull all the coolant lines now too.
4) Remove intake manifold *you'll have the entire upper wiring harness here just hang it out of the way. Id suggest labeling all the connectors if you arent familiar with them.

Nows a fun part
5) Removing the timing cover.. *have to loosen the alternator and power steering and take the belts off as well as the harmonic balancer. Then Id take a piece of 2x4 on a floor jack and put just a little pressure on the oil pan to remove the driver side motor mount (this will make things a lot easier and more room) Plus youll have to raise the engine up slightly to get the water pump pullys out. then the numerous 10mm bolts on the front cover..

6) Now timing belt. Loosen the tensioner pulley (14mm bolt) then pull the timing belt off.

7) Now take the valve cover off and remove the 10 head bolts (they will be tight!!!) and pull the head off..

Install is basically the reverse.. VFAQ has a good write up on doing a timing belt.. Actually its linked above!!

The engine rotates clockwise and you can put the engine to TDC after the head is removed. Now have at it.


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Old 05-30-2012, 08:39 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #4 (permalink)
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Yes, it's possible to set the engine in the TDC. Remove the spark plugs look at the position of the piston, if there is no room for the valve than, move the carnk away from the head, just enough for a full valve lift. When you have enough space put the camshaft sprocket marks toward eachother to time the head. Put the crank to TDC. I do hope the the timing belt didn't snap at high rpm, because we have iterfirence engines and most of the time we end up with valve and piston damage.

When you take off the head check for damage marks on the piston from the valve, if they are present, I suggest checking the cylinder walls for scoring and replacing that piston and valve. Also check the head for damage, I strongly recommend giving your head to machine shop, so that they can measure and fix in case there was valve damage. If there is no valve damage, measure the head for warpage, reseat the valves, leak test them, and put new seals. I still recommend resurfacing the head it's only $40 at my machine shop.

It's not a good idea to remove the timing belt without setting the timing first, the cam can jump and valve can hit a piston. But in your case it docent really matter cause the car was running when timing went. But I would still do the TDC, you never know.

Last edited by Vladimir; 05-30-2012 at 08:46 PM. Reason: Auto-merged with previous post to prevent "bumping" within a 24 hour period Tips on avoiding the auto-merge feature - http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/faq.php?faq=vb_faq#faq_bumping
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Old 05-31-2012, 04:50 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #5 (permalink)
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You guys are removing a lot more than necessary. Since your timing belt broke don't worry about setting timing until you're ready to put the head on.

I don't remove the turbo, just pull the 4 bolts out of the turbo then wire it up to keep from damaging the water and oil lines.

Remove the power steering pump from the bracket then remove the bracket itself. I can't get to the bottom right exhaust manifold bolt without doing that. Remove the exhaust manifold, unhook the fuel rail and throttle cable, tie them out of the way, then remove the head bolts. I don't remove the intake manifold until the head is off the car. Lot easier to get to those bottom bolts that way. I also install the intake before I put the head back on.

Then follow the manual. It's pretty much cut and dried from there, just remove and replace.

One trick to putting the water pump pulles on is to put a stud in one of the water pump holes to align and hold the two pulleys in place until you can get the bolts started.

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Old 05-31-2012, 05:57 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #6 (permalink)
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Why are y'all saying remove the water pump? Its attached to the block not the head. Power steering doesn't have to come off either.

Leave both manifolds on. Remove fans. Disconnect turbo by the four bolts. Support it to not damage any lines. Disconnect all electrical connections, fuel line, and any vacuum lines to the head, fuel return line. Basically anything connected to the head disconnect it. Your water outlet.

Take your valve cover off remove head bolts (don't forget to remove any ground wire), then remove the head.


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Old 05-31-2012, 06:00 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SrKegler View Post
You guys are removing a lot more than necessary. Since your timing belt broke don't worry about setting timing until you're ready to put the head on.

I don't remove the turbo, just pull the 4 bolts out of the turbo then wire it up to keep from damaging the water and oil lines.

Remove the power steering pump from the bracket then remove the bracket itself. I can't get to the bottom right exhaust manifold bolt without doing that. Remove the exhaust manifold, unhook the fuel rail and throttle cable, tie them out of the way, then remove the head bolts. I don't remove the intake manifold until the head is off the car. Lot easier to get to those bottom bolts that way. I also install the intake before I put the head back on.

Then follow the manual. It's pretty much cut and dried from there, just remove and replace.

One trick to putting the water pump pulles on is to put a stud in one of the water pump holes to align and hold the two pulleys in place until you can get the bolts started.
A dab of RTV between the WP,PS pulley and WP pulley also works wonders. It acts like glue and holds the PS pulley to the WP pulley as there is not much room in there and this can become a very frustrating step.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:01 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #8 (permalink)
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Well thanks for all the advice you guys, I got it off. Wasnt that hard, and honestly its a lot easier just to keep the intake mani on like a lot of you suggested.
Instead of making another thread Im pretty much just going to use this one for questions regarding maintenance on the head.

This is pretty much what all my valves look like


And here are images of the pistons






Anything off, or looks like it needs replacing? Im just not sure what I should be looking for ya know

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Old 06-07-2012, 09:05 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #10 (permalink)
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i read all that stuff, and its very involved, I dont feel like Im ready for a lot of that kind of work yet. But i really do appreciate the abundance of information. Actually bookmarked every page.
Since Im still learning, I figure Id take it to a machine shop. They only want 65$ to inspect it, so i might as well get it checked right the first time.
Im definitely going to make sure they dont belt sand the surface of it though, that was a good read.

However i see you said pull the cams, do you recommend I pull the cams before I drop it off at the shop as well?

Also for the bottom end, I have a lot of grease and oil everywhere, especially on the timing side. What do you guys recommend using to clean it up while its still in the car?

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Old 06-07-2012, 09:17 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #11 (permalink)
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I understand some of it is advanced, and takes special tooling and equipment to do.

The reason for it tho is so you understand what is going on, and what you should look for in a machine shop.

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