Welcome to DSMtuners - the largest Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, 4G63t and 420A DSM performance resource on the web



















Login



Go Back   DSMtuners > DSM Forums > DSM Tech > Electrical Tech
Welcome to DSMtuners - the largest Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, 4G63t and 420A DSM performance resource
You are browsing the site as a GUEST. Please login (or register) and gain the ability to post on our site and interact with other DSMers. You also get to browse the site with fewer advertisements. It is FREE to join!

Electrical Tech: Wiring, turbo timers, electronic boost controllers, gauges, fuses, wiring harnesses, wire tucks, car audio, and all other electrical component discussions.

Reply
 
LinkBack   Thread Tools
Old 01-08-2011, 11:40 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #1 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown

Resolved-no power to the ecu


hey i need help

my ecu is not recieving any power from pin 12 or 25, thus causing my car to not wana try to crank and the fuel pump not comming on.
the relay in the dash behind the radio has been changed 3 times and it never makes any clicking noises.
this relay also does not have a constant 12v going to it like i think it should even when the key is off.
whats weird is when i probe the fuel pump wire at the ecu with my test light while having the key on acc, the pump will run until i let the probe off.
i have messed with the neutral saftey switch with no luck.
On my ecu pin it says the wire should be black,, this is not the case, it is black with a red stripe.
I would like to try and bypass the N switch at the transmission as it is an automatic 2g, but i can not figure out the wire schematics on how to do so, and i am unsure if this would allow power to enter my ecu even if i did.
I checked and bypassed the 20amp 30 amp and the 100amp fuses under the hood one at a time to make sure this was not my problem. it did not help.
every now and then i'll here some clicking comming from where the neutral saftey switch is located.....
I also changed the ignition switch with no luck. please help.

i also locked and unlocked the car with the key to make sure it wasn't the saftey feature,

i also ran a wire from the fuse panel with a constant 12v to the mfi relay where it says 30 amps, as this is suppose to stay charged and it doesn't, with my hard wire it does but has not fixed the problem and the relay still does not click or allow power to the ecu.

i am considering the neutral saftey switch. :how do you get rid of this on an automatic that is staying automatic?

~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
i connected the neutral saftey wires, red with black stripe big, to the black big wire... nothing changed.

i tried grounding the last mentioned wire, it already had ground and i added one, nothing changed,
i ran from the 30 amp fuse power to the #12 and 25 pin the ecu starts up and shows the ecu light for 5 secs, so thats a sign the ecu is good i do believe. problem being the relay still isn't triggering the starter and the fuel pump..... why.....?

also side note, now when the ecu is working so does my keychain to lock and unlock the doors, i checked to make sure it wasn't the security system again and it is not...
please shoot me some more ideas to do, as i have swapped every othe mfi plug in the car where this one is and it isn't changing a thing, and i know they are good because i have tested them in other spots. the mfi plug seems to not be making it's ground properly,, where should i look for this at?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
++++++++++++++++++++++++++

okay so heres what i have done, the mfi relay: i added a ground to the side that wasn't getting it for some reason.... this allows the starter to now crank over.
although the ecu light isn't comming on because it's still not getting power.
so i add the 30 amp fuse direct path power wire to one of the terminals, i think 25, noww the fuel pump kicks on and it turns over and the cel light comes on for 5 seconds,
I am here by myself so checking for spark is hard, i manage, and i have none.
I can only assume that the relay is messing that up too... i think what the heck is going on with this?

i have swapped this relay numerous times and still nothing,, and how come i am not getting fire even bypassing it.?




some info i might try that i found.(


Originally Posted by Turblown
Here is the short version of what it says to check for the relay.

Section 4-3, Fuel Injection Control Relay Check. (just the relay)
This tests the MPI side of the MPI relay
step 32 - Remove EFI relay
step 33 - Connect battery positive (+) to terminal 10 and battery negative (-) to terminal 8
This should activate the one side of the relay causing it to connect pin 10 to pin 4 and 5
step 34 - Connect voltmeter negative probe to the battery negative terminal, Connect voltmeter positive probe to terminal 4 and then to terminal 5, There should be 12volts at each terminal.
if you do this before step 22 you'll see pin 4 and 5 don't have 12v before hand and do after

This tests the fuel pump side of the MPI relay
step 35 - Connect battery positive (+) to terminal 9 and battery negative (-) to terminal 6
step 36 - Check for continuity between terminals 2 and 3, there should be continuity, next remove the ground lead from terminal 6 and check again, there should be no continuity.
step 37 - Connect battery positive (+) to terminal 3 and battery negative (-) to terminal 7
step 38 - Check for voltage between terminal 2 and the battery ground, there should be 12v
step 39 - If the test results are incorrect, replace relay with new part.

According to this my relay passed, but maybe not.

What this doesn't test is that MPI relay is functioning in the car. For that you need to check that you have 12v at the connector for pin 10 all the time, turn on the ignition switch and verify you have 12v at pins 4 and 5 when the ignition switch is in the run or start position.
If the the relay checked out but you done see 12v at 4 and 5 then you need to look at the ECU and the signals going to it. )


Last edited by KeelesKustome; 04-06-2011 at 04:29 AM. Reason: Auto-merged with previous post to prevent "bumping" within a 24 hour period Tips on avoiding the auto-merge feature - http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/faq.php?faq=vb_faq#faq_bumping

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2011, 05:09 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #2 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
alrighty: no responses still ehh. who wants to help burn my car?

what can i say? syptoms have slighty changed.

tonight i put the original relay back in, i have added a ground to the side that doesn't seem to want to ground on it's own, and the car will turn over like none other. but still no fuel pimp or ecu light..
so i put my hard wired power wire to pin 25, the fuel pump and ecu light do their thing, i checked to see if pin 4 &5 get power when i turn the key and they do,, it's delayyed and blinks like it's surging the power or something.
although
pin 10 ignition power transitor( a to coil for cyl 1&4) , pin 38 mfi relay power supply
pin 71 ignition switch, pin82 ignition switch 1g all do not recieve any power with how i have it setup with the hard wired power wire,


so i know i still have problems but i don't understand where? whats also interesting is with this setup i plugged in my dsmlink and it works, it allowed me to manipulate all the functions normally.. this blew me away, as i didn't expect it to work.
something odd as well is the neutral saftey switch on the tranny keeps randomly making a clicking sound, sometimes it's a short burst of sound, other times it is a long click sound.


correct me if i am wrong but the neutral saftey switch would keep it from turning over right?
if so is this why i have to add a ground to the relay for it to turn over?

but would that keep the ecu from seeing power?

or is it causing the mfi relay to not ground thus not sending power to the ecu as well?

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2011, 05:38 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #3 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
I'm posting so ill remeber to read your pposts and properly reply in detail later. First thought at a glance is the ecu is damaged. The circuit that pulls the mpi to ground and acitaves it. Mines done that before.



Sent from my Droid

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2011, 05:41 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #4 (permalink)
Supporting VIP
 

1990AWD's Avatar
Registered: Apr 2009
Tech Posts: 1,429
Classifieds Rating: 3
Reputation: 1990AWD is pretty helpful and trustworthy
try PMing Steve. he'll know.


____________________________
Mike.
'94 3000GT VR-4 2012: 14.1@98 on 9bs
'90 Eclipse GSR-4 2011: 13.3@104 on 14b
2013: 12.7@110 on 16g

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2011, 07:19 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #5 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
This is my interpretation of the fsm and my experienced with 1gs. I know yours is a 2g, but its all relevant

The ecu should receive power on pin 25 and 12 from the mpi when pin 38 on the ecu is pulled to ground. And the fuel pump is kicked on when pin 8 of the ecu is pulled to ground.

pin 38 is pulled to ground anytime that the ecu gets a power from the ignition wire, at pin 82.
pin 8 is pulled to ground under certain conditions when the ignition provides power to pin 82.

With key on check for power at pin 82. If you have power there , attempt to provide grounds for pins 8 & 38 to bypass the ecus mpi control and force it on. By grounding those two pins, you should have power to the fuel pump and pins 12&25.

Make sure there is continuity between pin 38 and pin 8 of the ecu with there respective mpi terminals. I would say which, but the pin numbering for the mpi on the fsm is illegible.


Pin 71 is the ecu signal for the key in the start position. should only have voltage when turned to start, fsm says over 8volts is acceptable.. If it doesn't have power in the start position you"ll have to: check continuity between pin for the ecu and pin 4 for the starter relay. then verify that the relay works, make sure pin 4 has continuity with pin 5 when pin 1 is connected to power and pin 3 is connected to ground. then check continuity between pin 1 for the starter relay and pin 9 on connector B-63. If the cause for no power to pin 71 is not found by this point theres an issue with the theft deterrent system.

You said you have no spark, but do you know if you have injector pulse?
Do you have power to the coils? I can explain how to determine if needed.
All the while your not throwing any codes?

*edit. I found a discrepancy in my manuals. The electrical manual says pin 82 for Ig1 voltage input, and the body/motor book says pin 92...though its in a list between 81 and 83. mistype perhaps?

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 04:45 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #6 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
I'm gona try in order what you have written.

as for the previous comment about the ecu being bad. i don't believe that it would allow me to hook my dsmlink up if it were bad, also woundering if my 1g engine swap cas may be turned out 180. causing the no fire.

either way i need my ecu to see power , other than being jumped form a positive 30 amp fuse.

to the previous post, you don't recon my neutral saftey switch could cause all this do ya?
also when the ecu is powered up my key chain lock , panic etc... work and their is no blinking red light on my car, and in my history that tells me the security is fine. whats your opinion?

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 05:29 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #7 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
I'm not really familiar enough to comment on the security system. If you can unlock it, it should be fine.

The circuit for the mpi activation has nothing to do with communications. Ecu might still need replaced.

The neurtal safety switch just disables the starter relay, if you bypassed it, it would still run.

Sent from my Droid

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 07:48 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #8 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
okay.... hmm.
so the relay sends power to the ecu which in turn sends power back and forth telling everything to work correctly..
soooo i need to remove my bypassed ground on the relay and check what you have mentioned. I'm just thinking why am i having to bypass the groud on the relay to get it to turn over?

would that mean my relay is for sure bad?
either way i just ordered a new one from MIt's dealer, and it'll be here thursday.

the ecu being bad: I baught it for nearly $400 from Twenty5psi on here, and he swears up one side and down the other it worked/ran etc.. and has witnesses of this. I tend to believe him as well.
I opened the box and it has no smell and no burnt spots.

here is a random thing, 2 yrs ago my dogs ripped my bumper off and ripped up my wiring harness on the passenger front side, around 9 wires were damaged, but most were still together, i fixed them the proper way, whats the chances one of the 5 black wires may have got crossed causing this? as their are alot of identical solid black wires with silver dots. i measured the distance of the dots and made sure when re-applying solder that the wires were indeed dot spaced correctly to identify the wires... needless to say i am 99.9% sure this isn't my issue just a side note.

also: i don't think i had bypassed the n saftey switch correctly. as it's an auto and their seems to be some confusion in the dsm world to do so.

Last edited by KeelesKustome; 01-10-2011 at 09:40 AM.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 08:38 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #9 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
To clear up confusion, there is no neutral safety switch on an automatic. There is an park/neutral position switch, it reads the gear lever location.



ignition start > theft relay > starter relay> park/neutral position switch> ecu.

ecu provides a ground path for the 12v, thus energizing the starter relay, if and only if the etacs ecu(theft deterrent) has already energized the theft relay for the voltage to pass through.

I don"t know how well you can read schematics, but this should help if you can.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 08:47 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #10 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

Absit's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2002
Tech Posts: 2,024
Classifieds Rating: 1
Reputation: Absit is extremely helpful and trustworthyAbsit is extremely helpful and trustworthyAbsit is extremely helpful and trustworthy
Send a message via AIM to Absit Send a message via MSN to Absit
I couldn't even begin to read your post. Colors, bold, tildes everywhere. Type a proper paragraph if you want a proper response.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 08:53 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #11 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
HAHAHAH I read it all via my phone so it wasn't gaytarded. I agree

Next Ill just start replying in ninja type.

Then I'll just hide it in the shadows to never ever ever be seen again lol.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 04:24 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #12 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
Quote:
Originally Posted by Absit View Post
I couldn't even begin to read your post. Colors, bold, tildes everywhere. Type a proper paragraph if you want a proper response.
sorry the colors are for evertime i add something, so it can be seen what has been automerged.
sorry i wasted your time.

BTW: you add to this thread was neither helpfull or worth my time.
(good thing you didn't mention spelling, that would have been really oxymoronic) I get sick of going through threads where people need help and find resposes like that.

Last edited by KeelesKustome; 01-11-2011 at 07:37 AM.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 04:28 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #13 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
Don't fret the little stuff, just use bolder colors. The only one I can't stand is the salmon color, its all white text on black when I read it off my phone so it ain't a big deal.

What I want to know is where in that schematic you had to jump to ground to make work.



Sent from my Droid

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 06:00 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #14 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
okay,
we have searched and followed and found that my alarm system isn't recieving power, inturn it's the fuel pump relay is not getting power because the ecu is not getting power and the starter relay is not getting a constant 12v either.

the ignition switch is giving the power it is suppose to with the key to acc and all the way forward...... we are verry lost now.

what the heck....

also their is a ground on the passenger side of the center compartment, near the mfi and fuel pump relay, it looks factory and it is cut. any ideas where this wire is suppose to go? it's all by it'sself bolted to the metal frame of the dash.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 12:34 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #15 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
Ground wire near the ecu just gets grounded to a bolt near the ecu.

I'm looking into the theft system problem.



Theres a lot of fused inputs. Verify again to ensure your not making a simple mistake.



Ignore the J/B#11 fuse here thats thh blower, oops. The dedicated #11 fuse is in the engine bay.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 01:49 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #16 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
your diahgram isn't the correct one for my automatic with an alarm system, the relay for the alarm is up under the dash not near your kick panel, and it's the top left square relay, with the same schematics as the starter relay behind the radio,

the ignition is sending power out, but as you can see in this diagram even though it's not the best, we have an Alldata one we have been using and it shows that the antitheft should recieve power at the same time the ecu sends power to the mfi while alsoeving power to the starter and fuel pump relay.

none of this is occuring at all,

we tried adding a 12v directly to the antitheft fuse where the 12v constant should be, but it changed nothing... meaning that the power still isn't making it past the ignition transitor box or something..
i tested it and all of them seemd to be grounds, which i thought was interesting, as it has a blue and red wire going to it, which is the same color as the power back up supply for the ecu... now why would that be going to the transitor ground box on the firewall?


i colored it if you can see.

i have deleted my cruise system, but the fact remains that my starter still isn't even getting something to try to crank. when the key is turned to on it gets power, but the relay isn't switching for the ground to engage because the ecu isn't getting power to tell it too.. i have a short in a narrow area, but i cannot find it, and i don't understand why i would in the first place as none of this has been touched in the time it has been blown up.,, i really hope your right and i am over complicating it. at this point i am either going to buy a new wiring harness and see if that fixes it or part the car out and cut my losses.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 05:13 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #17 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
Which diagram isn't right?

Yours says b-57 is the starter relay, mine does to...for a 2.4 m/t car.

Yours is a 2.0 turbo auto, right???

Where don't you have power at the etacs, described by connector#,pin, and color preferablly

After we sort out out connect differences... Go through this. tell me where the 12v ceases to exist. I Imagine you wont have 12v after b-44x pin4. Verify this please.

battery
sub-fusible #6 30A
b-78 pin 1
b-09 pin 1 (ignition switch plug)
b-09 pin 5 -------(with key in start position from here forward)
B-44x pin 4 (theft relay)
B-44x pin 3 (theft relay)
---------------------------
If you don't have 12v at B-44x pin 3, see if there is power at B-44x pin 2.
----------------------------
B-63 pin 9
B-96 pin 1 (starter relay)
B-96 pin3 (starter relay)
A-101 pin 8 (inhibitor switch)
A-101 pin 7 (inhibitor switch)
----------------------------
B-96 pin 5 (Starter relay)
B-96 pin 4 (stater relay)
A-34 pin2 (engine harness to starter harness)
A-35 pin1 (on starter solenoid)



Edit:
This is from the factory service manual, not alldata. For a 2.0 turbo 97-99 eclipse.


Edit: It doesn't appear that the etacs theft ecu can do anything other than interrupt power to the starter. It doesn't look like it has the ability to affect ecu power,mpi power or any of the sort.

If you were to jump B-44x pin 4 to pin 3 that seems to me as if it would complete bypass the theft system. Thoughts, opinons?

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 06:42 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #18 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
I'm pretty positive that the car is designed where jumping the antitheft is slim to none.
although i do see what your saying, and my mechanic who's been helping just remembered he has a tool he baught and hasn't ever used that goes on wires and fuses and tells if the signal is interupted or broke somewhere, this may be my salvation, because for the last month it's been hit or miss trying to work on it and i'm mentally drained and i'm ready to throw in the towel.

edit: the starter relay is getting power, it's not switching the ground over to crank, i am unsure if bypassing the antitheft would even help that.
also why does it have so much about the cruise controll on here...>? i deleted mine this go around, do you recon that might have anything to do with it.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 06:57 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #19 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

sniver's Avatar
Registered: Feb 2006
Tech Posts: 674
Classifieds Rating: 2
Reputation: sniver is extremely helpful and trustworthysniver is extremely helpful and trustworthy
That tool is either a continuity test, or a multimeter on ohms.
Ignore the cruise crap, it makes no difference.
If the starter relay getting power, then its not a theft system problem. its after the theft system.

Just do that test I asked, completly, and I can proceed from there. Were jumping around system not verifing much. I still think its a ground or the ecu.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2011, 07:51 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #20 (permalink)
Proven Member
 

KeelesKustome's Avatar
Registered: Dec 2007
Tech Posts: 683
Classifieds Rating: 26
Reputation: KeelesKustome is an unknown
i will, i brought the ecu home to inspect it again and take photos. the fellow at ecmlink doesn't think it's my ecu just because it's not getting any power to it, and when i do give it power, all the functions work properly.

mark post as helpful recommend reputation points    Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

 

» Recent DSM Photo
» Current Poll
How many times have you been to the Shootout?
1 - 39.86%
167 Votes
2-5 - 41.77%
175 Votes
6-10 - 10.50%
44 Votes
11-15 - 3.10%
13 Votes
16-20 - 4.77%
20 Votes
Total Votes: 419
You may not vote on this poll.
» Online Users: 784
201 members and 583 guests
Most users ever online was 1,704, 03-17-2008 at 09:11 PM.
DSMtuners Main Sections
DSM Forums
DSM Regional Forums
DSM Builds/Journals
DSM Articles
DSM Tech Guides
DSM Upgrade Paths
DSM Parts Reviews
DSM Vendor Reviews

DSM Classifieds
DSM Parts Guides
DSM Photos
DSM Videos
DSM Timeslips
DSM Dyno Sheets
Shirts & Apparel
DSMtuners Decals

Advertising Info
Our Sponsors
Site Rules
Terms of Service
Privacy Policy
Site FAQ
About Us
Contact Us

© 2014 DSMtuners.com - All Rights Reserved

DSMtuners is not affiliated with Diamond Star Motors. The Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, Plymouth Laser, Mitsubishi Galant VR-4, and associated logos are trademarks of Diamond Star Motors, Mitsubishi Motors, and Chrysler Corporation. No, we do not hand out car sponsorships.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:06 PM.


Vendor Tools vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.

Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0