to mod or not to

[thumper]

Alright I'm still planning this engine work. I'm going to replace the pistons with 95 pistons. by doing this i'm increasing from 7.8(??) to 8.5:1 does this increase in compression make a difference for the good or bad on 1G AWD turbo. second question. IF the cylinder walls look ok no scaring. then do i need to drop the engine, or can i just drop the pan to swap pistons. third question. while i'm doing this work on the engine, would it help to make the car more efficient if i shange the cams. I'm looking at a daily driven street/drag 12/13sec car. If i cange the cams will i need to invest in a fuel management system? I would if i knew i could control it. I'm no engine genius, so i'll tell eveyone. i'm afraid to screw up the fuel tuning, and therefore end up slowing my car down. It seems like fuel tuning is difficult, if it's not tell me and i'll be willing to do it if i need to. Keep in mind i'm looking to build a reliable engine. I want to keep stress at minimals so if it's going to make it easier on the car i'm all for it.

P.S. I wanna thank everyone for the help/information that i've been recieving. I've learned an unimaginable amount of information in the last 2 weeks. THANKS

 

[UltraImports]

well....you run into a few problems asking for everything you want. 12 second, reliable, efficient.....those three can be acheived but is not always easy to do (IMO).

The higher compression should give you more sack....good stuff. A lot of people do this and are happy.

It's a lot easier to work on an engine outside of the car, but if you have no choice (like me), put it on some jack stands and go to town.

You have to drop your exhaust, remove the transfer case, remove the plate next to the oil pan on the tranny, remove the oil pan (one bolt is a pain in the ass, right above the axle. You can remove it with an open end, or just pull the axle out). The oil pan should be sealed with liquid gasket or something similar. Best way to get off is by getting something flat in there, then tapping your way around. Once that is off, remove the oil ufo (that's what it looks like. You should be able to unbolt the pistons and tap them up from there. Do what you must, reverse the order.

You'll need to clean the top of the oil pan to get the old liquid gasket off before you put more on when you bolt it back in.

Don't forget to drain your fluids before all of this. Be sure to use a lower weight of oil for a few thousand miles before you upgrade (if you normally use sythetic, etc.)

 

[DSM91]

You don't need aftermarket cams for a 12 to 13 second car. Most 1g AWD DSMs run low 13s with barely any mods at all. Get a Big 16G with 660 injectors, walbro 255, and an SAFC, and you will have consistent mid 12s with plenty of reliability. (of course you will need the rest of the supporting mods as well).

As for efficiency... I still get around 320 miles to the tank on the highway with 650cc injectors on an FP Green running 20psi. You can still be plenty efficient....at least on the highway. Say goodbye to around town mpg.

 

[candela]

Well if it were me i would sure as hell want to get the block either bored (depending on how bad they are, but if you have a stock 1g motor with a bunch o miles it may be a good idea) or at leist honed out with some stock bore rings to make for a goos seat.

Keep in mind it is pretty simple to have a 12/13second car reliably (especially if your awd). There are tons of post in the archives of this place telling how simple it is by following the tuning guide route. You do not even need to swap pistons, swap cams, get to in depth with fuel mods or any of that if you jus twant to touch 12's or what have you. Although a nicely rebuilt motor without BS and some 2g pistons is an awesome setup, it is simply not needed at all if thats all your looking to get.

Simply put, my 140k car had 3" turbo back/550's/255/afc/big16g/race fuel and i knocked of numerous 12.6-13.0 timeslips. It really not hard, and as you start modding youll see the potential as each upgrade to these motors usually will give something quite noticable, espeically when running more boost that stock. I recommend simply following the awesome tuning guide thats been put together on this board, as it should take you right to where you need to be


Austin

 

[xleRateGSX]

4g63 is strong from the start. That is what gives us an edge on the competition. You can upgrade turbo with supporting mods and still be reliable with the right tuning. Don't spend money on one setup and then go for another. If you want 12s then go with something that will get you there (20g etc.) if you want 13s then 16g will get you there. Good luck...

 

[candela]

14b will get you to 12's...

 

[thumper]

i understand that i wouldn't need pistons and cams to reach 12's. the problem is the car needs pistons. well actually it needs one. The engine needs work, so i'm gonna get a good deal. it needs a piston because it pushed a valve and that gouged a piston. sompression check shows cylinder 1 is dead. what do you mean by pick something that will get you there. 12's 20g 13's 16g. i'm pretty sure just as stated above the 14b can make 12-13. but i don't plan on trying for 12 with the 14b. First i want to reach 13 on the 14b then if that's not fast enough i'm gonna get a 16g and go for more. like i said before i don't wanna tune fuel if i don't have to. but you guys have me confused, do i need afc, or is that just something to add reliability and consistency. if so i'll save more money.

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by candela
14b will get you to 12's...

Keep dreaming

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by thumper
i don't wanna tune fuel if i don't have to. but you guys have me confused, do i need afc, or is that just something to add reliability and consistency. if so i'll save more money.

You HAVE to. The car wont run well unless you have a well tuned SAFC especially with bigger injectors. But like everyone else said a big 16g, fuel pump, safc, and ACT 2600 with some practive you should be in the high 12s.

 

[thumper]

hmmm? what happened to all the people that make 12's off of a boost controller a full exhaust and hacked intake. is this stuff just a bunch of bs or do you just need to be good.

 

[thumper]

i never said i was getting injectors. i wanted to stay away from that if i can. i have to do the pistons to get the car running correctly. i'm going to change the exhaust while i have it off. the car has a new clutch so i'm not gonna replace a new one.

 

[candela]

Well my friend had the stock 14b, 450cc's, afc, 255 pump, fmic, 3" turbo back and race fuel running 21psi = 12.8@106

 

[Tom N]

Originally posted by rdrkt

Keep dreaming

Phil Beers.

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by thumper
hmmm? what happened to all the people that make 12's off of a boost controller a full exhaust and hacked intake. is this stuff just a bunch of bs or do you just need to be good.

You can do that on 110 leaded but not pump gas. Take any car that just has a hacked MAS add a safc to it and it will make more power and be more driveable.

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by 90tsiawd
Phil Beers.

I’m not going to hold my breathe trying to beat Phil OR Curt Brown. Those are speacial guys with speacial cars. That I would put in the kids dont try this at home segment.

 

[Tom N]

Originally posted by rdrkt

I’m not going to hold my breathe trying to beat Phil OR Curt Brown. Those are speacial guys with speacial cars. That I would put in the kids dont try this at home segment.

Not to mention i would like to know how many trannies they go through a week.

 

[InferiorWang]

Youre gonna need injectors if you ever want to run more than 16 or 17 psi. If you want to get into the 12's consistently you will NEED injectors and a S-AFC. It may be possible to touch 12's without, but that's pushing the limit.

 

[WhipmastaFlex]

yeah if you're talking about 12's and wanting to avoid tuning fuel and such, you might want to start talking 13's instead. if you start running 12s on a stock fuel system, it'll be a matter of time, if not seconds.

im in your boat with the pistons. had a detonation about a month ago and went ahead and purchased 4 wiseco forged pistons, and had the block bored over .020. i figured while i had the block out, might as well do all i can (or all my wallet lets me) before she goes back in.

Adam

 

[thumper]

ok u guys have me convinced that i need a fuel management system to make it reliable, now another question if i'm gonna get fuel management should i go ahead and get cams while i'm at it.

 

[rdrkt]

First reply to you post.

Originally posted by DSM91
You don't need aftermarket cams for a 12 to 13 second car. Most 1g AWD DSMs run low 13s with barely any mods at all.

I agree get a 16g fuel pump and a safc and you will hit your goals.

 

[got traction?]

Sell the body kit on your car and you might run 12's.

 

[thumper]

i plan on selling the whole car since i'm modding a talon and not my laser. any one want a car that attracts mad attention

 

[cucumber]

It attracts mad attention because of that damn horrendous wing on your roof.

 

[thumper]

thanks i can always count on someone to jump on me for the wing. i'll take off the wing to sell it and post a pic of it to make so many people happy.

 

[cucumber]

Originally posted by thumper
thanks i can always count on someone to jump on me for the wing. i'll take off the wing to sell it and post a pic of it to make so many people happy.

We'll appreciate it.