Aem Plug And Play Ems

[nowayout]

I know that there out for the 2G. I'm wondering how it's working in your cars.


I've had a VPC, GCC(safc) and reprogram ecu on the MKIVTTS. That setup is good in one way and not in others.


I want to get a unit for my 92 GSX. Which it should be out within the next three months here.

 

[IPT]

I have a friend that has it for his 2G he is waiting on his turbo header and intercooler after that it will be ready to go. I will have him post what he thinks ASAP.

 

[2-0turbo]

I am planning on buying one for my 1G when they come out. I was very close to buying a SAFC, but now that this is rolling and I have seen the software and the feedback from the 2G owners--I am sold. It is only a matter of money and time now. : )

 

[logic]

May the DSMtuners gods strike me down for what I am about to do, but there's a very thorough thread about the AEM EMS over at the "other site", covering dyno information, configuration, and all manner of questions with answers from the AEM DSM/3S point-man. Maybe someone should bug John@AEM to consider keeping DSMtuners in mind for updates about the EMS?

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by 2-0turbo
I am planning on buying one for my 1G when they come out. I was very close to buying a SAFC, but now that this is rolling and I have seen the software and the feedback from the 2G owners--I am sold. It is only a matter of money and time now. : )

Matt a SAFC and a standalone are world apart. If you don’t have a ton of tuning experience you are going to need to get someone else to set it up for your which will be very expensive. Does your current level of mods call for a full standalone?

 

[2-0turbo]

Originally posted by rdrkt


Matt a SAFC and a standalone are world apart. If you don’t have a ton of tuning experience you are going to need to get someone else to set it up for your which will be very expensive. Does your current level of mods call for a full standalone?

Indeed they are! Long ago, I investigated the possibility of using a Motec unit and would love the challenge. The biggest hurdle to that on a street car is the wiring harness. And, at least for now, it appears that AEM is providing a level of support that is unparalleled in the industry.

Right now, I do not have the mods to justify a standalone. But, I have a ETE32 just waiting to be bolted on. My fuel upgrades (minus injectors) are almost complete. I am waiting on FMIC and some other stuff. My wideband O2 is almost done too.

Honestly, I do not have tons of tuning experience. I know engines and engine management systems pretty well, but I don't have a dyno in my garage. I am an engineer, so I have a technical background and love the challenge this presents. Ultimately, standalone is the best option. I have an EPROM ecu that I was going to have Todd massage and then SAFC on top of that--it gets too complicated and works just "okay". I can do everthing with the standalone.

 

[nowayout]

Spoke to AEM the unit for the first 1G will be out late AUG or early SEPT.
I like the unit because it opens the door to everything else. No more piggy backs.

For the money it's the best deal out there in stand alones.

 

[rdrkt]

Matt just as a counterpoint. I am making about 400 hp to the wheels on pump gas with a safc and a hacked mas and I have all the goodies trust me. I absolutely understand the value of an AEM. The Haltech has no knock sensor and is a #@%#@%#@%#@%#@% to wire. But I don’t know if I could justify the effort if I wasn’t making boat loads of power you would be surprised for far you can stretch a $300 safc. All that being said I am awaiting the release of the AEM with baited breathe. Im sure I will have that on and tuned by late Sept early Oct.

 

[2-0turbo]

Rdrkt, I know the value of the SAFC. For the money, it definitely provides a lot of flexibility. I commend you on your effort too. 400 WHP on pump gas is no easy matter. Andre, (dre99gsx) who has a 2G has also accompished 400 WHP. I know he has tried numberous other ECU's though: Pro-efi, I think he has played with a VPC too.

So, I know you can do it, but it has its limitations too. My buddy has an AFC, 650, 16G with FMIC, 2G MAS, etc. He has his tuned pretty well, but it is still "funny" sometimes with part throttle stuff, throttle tip-in, etc. I mean, it has worked for him, but you have to overlook some stuff too.

I plan on keeping my car as a daily driver and want it to be comforatable and driveable in that capacity. I think having the EMS, once it is tuned, will allow me to do whatever I need to do. It will also allow me to play with water injection, and just about anything else I can think to do with all those outputs!

 

[nowayout]

2-0Turbo
I plan on keeping my car as a daily driver and want it to be comforatable and driveable in that capacity. I think having the EMS, once it is tuned, will allow me to do whatever I need to do. It will also allow me to play with water injection, and just about anything else I can think to do with all those outputs!


That's the reason the I want the unit.

 

[venom2097]

I just checked ebay for prices on different ems(honda...acura...) and they are a lot of money $800-1200+ so the mitsu one should be at least $1000+

 

[nowayout]

If you look at Electromotive $2000+ and Motec @ $4000 +.
$1200-1400 for the AEM is a DEAL.

the usual setup
vpc $1000
SAFC $300
Reprogram ECU $300-$500


It will end up costing the more and you get less. If your doing it in steps it's OK. but in the end it will caost you more money.

 

[rdrkt]

Dont forget to include a pocketlogger in your total. Its a smoking deal any way you look at it.

 

[IPT]

RRE has them for sale. I have a friend that has one sitting next to his car at this moment.

 

[2-0turbo]

Originally posted by IPT
RRE has them for sale. I have a friend that has one sitting next to his car at this moment.

Only for 2G's, right?

 

[nowayout]

oNLY 2g AT THIS TIME

 

[RocketDSM]

My real question is this: Is the AEM any better than a DSMLink? The link is only $600, and looks/acts stock (for those of us with pesky nosy emission inspectors, we care). And yes, I've had inspectors look at my computer. Also, is there a viable difference between AEMs Plug & Play, and the Racing PMS? It would seem to me, after reading AEMs website, that the P&P isn't worth the cost over a DSMLink, but the Racing PMS might be. Thoughts?

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by RocketDSM
My real question is this: Is the AEM any better than a DSMLink? The link is only $600, and looks/acts stock (for those of us with pesky nosy emission inspectors, we care). And yes, I've had inspectors look at my computer. Also, is there a viable difference between AEMs Plug & Play, and the Racing PMS? It would seem to me, after reading AEMs website, that the P&P isn't worth the cost over a DSMLink, but the Racing PMS might be. Thoughts?

The DSMLink is a great product no doubt. It give you most of the features of a standalone without the hassle of trying design your own fuel map from scratch. But it definitely had its limitations. Also the price of the DSMLink is $600 IF you have an EPROM 95 ecu. If not then you have to cough up another $200 or so to be able to run it. Still for 90% of the people out there this will be more than adequate.

What is the Racing PMS that you are talking about?

Either way I think the AEM is the absolute best value in the standalone market right now. I literally can't wait until the release it.

 

[IPT]

I do not believe that the DSM link allows the removal of the MAF sensor to go with a speed density setup.

 

[RocketDSM]

Oh, sorry...EMS not PMS. Whatever. Look at AEMs site...

http://www.aempower.com/ems.htm

On top there is the "Plug and Play EMS" and below it is "Race Programmable EMS". Two different products, prices, applications, etc. That is what I was referring to.

As for speed density...I've heard of some problems going to s/d systems. Not as many as ours, but they are not without faults.

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by RocketDSM
As for speed density...I've heard of some problems going to s/d systems. Not as many as ours, but they are not without faults.

Again it all depends on what you are looking for. For over all power speed density is the champ. Plus that allows you to run a cold air setup. But speed density does not react as well to temperature changes as a MAS based setup would.

 

[BatmanGSX]

The thought of most people on this board trying to tune a standalone scares the #@%#@%#@%#@% out of me. Let's be honest with ourselves, people. I consider myself very knowledgable in the arena of tuning. Especially with a DSM ECU and MAS. Aside from the actual machine language the chips are written in I know what is going on with our cars, what does what, how it all works. And I would never want to touch a standalone. It is a world apart from any piggyback system. Instead of having a basis to start from, known points to work with (ie all the stock parameters and quirks of a DSM ECU/fuel/timing advance system) you are starting from scratch and inventing all that stuff yourself.

I doubt many of you know at what levels of knock you should stop advancing timing and then at what levels to reduce it and by how much. Who can tell us what IPW to run 660cc/min injectors with 50 lb/min of air entering the throttle body? See the issues that can come up? I know everyone has a hard on for things described as "standalones" with "plug and play" descriptions but it's not as simple as venting your BOV to the atmosphere and getting a "pshhhh" sound. This is serious money and serious consiquences if you #@%#@%#@%#@% it up.

I know you guys probably think I'm trying to be an a55hole, which is true, and that I think you guys are pretty moronic, which is also true, but at least I am lumping myself in with most of you: people who should stay away from standalones.

 

[rdrkt]

Batman I think that is the best advice you can give people. "Tooning" a standalone is tough and next to impossible if you dont know what you are doing. Hopefully most of the people that are doing this realize that they need a shop to do most of the tuning for them.

 

[2-0turbo]

Originally posted by BatmanGSX
The thought of most people on this board trying to tune a standalone scares the #@%#@%#@%#@% out of me. Let's be honest with ourselves, people. I consider myself very knowledgable in the arena of tuning. Especially with a DSM ECU and MAS. Aside from the actual machine language the chips are written in I know what is going on with our cars, what does what, how it all works. And I would never want to touch a standalone.

Good for you--then don't buy one. Why do you feel it is your duty to encourage others not to buy one? I have already admitted that I am not the Grand Master of engine tuning. I want to do it for the challenge, the understanding and the education. If I blow my motor, what do you care?

It is a world apart from any piggyback system.

Yes it is! Which is why some people (including myself) will be willing to spend $1400 on it. This isn't chump change. A lot of people on this board would spend this much money on wheels, but not a ECU. Simply put, a standalone provides ultimate control that you can't get with SAFC, Todd modded ECU's, VPC's or PMS's.

Instead of having a basis to start from, known points to work with (ie all the stock parameters and quirks of a DSM ECU/fuel/timing advance system) you are starting from scratch and inventing all that stuff yourself.

Not true. Unlike a Motec unit (I can't speak for Haltech, I don't know them), the EMS comes with base maps for about every parameter. The feedback from some Supra guys and 2G guys says that virtually everyone has been able to get in the car and drive immediately on the base maps. Lots of issues to work out, but the car runs. Rumor is, a soon to be released version will even use wideband O2 feedback to do auto-mapping of your fuel map! Wow!

I doubt many of you know at what levels of knock you should stop advancing timing and then at what levels to reduce it and by how much.

Trial and error, AND help from AEM's tech support. The knock sensor produces a 0-5 volt signal. I would start with about 2.0 volts. Remember the scientific process we learned about in high school? This is a great example of when it comes in handy. One of the selling features of this ECU is the great tech support from AEM, and other companies that know what they are doing like the guys at RRE. AEM knows what they are doing and their tech guys are more than happy to help you set knock threshholds and how much noise to filter out at what RPM. Have you been to the BBS yet?

Who can tell us what IPW to run 660cc/min injectors with 50 lb/min of air entering the throttle body?

Well, I would tell you, but to figure injector pulse width based on mass flow of air, you need to specify an RPM. But, this question is bogus. Will mass flow pop up anywhere in the PC interface? No. Mass flow is calculated from several variables and you never see the number.

I know you guys probably think I'm trying to be an a55hole, which is true, and that I think you guys are pretty moronic, which is also true, but at least I am lumping myself in with most of you: people who should stay away from standalones.

I won't comment on your first statement here, but what do you really care if scores of DSM'ers mess their engines up? It might be nice, then I could buy their EMS cheap off of the Trader when they decide to go back to the stock ECU. I suppose I understand your "warning" you are broadcasting here, but I think the price and complexity will scare most people away. Besides, the EMS doesn't look nice at all. Most people with AFC's and Vtec controllers buy them to stick on their dash because they look pretty at night. Perhaps if AEM planned on mounting this on the dash with neon highlights and priced it around $300, I might agree with you. Take it easy man...and don't go standalone. I want to beat you on the track!

 

[2-0turbo]

Originally posted by rdrkt
. Hopefully most of the people that are doing this realize that they need a shop to do most of the tuning for them.

You are kidding, right? Speak for yourself. I like to do my own work and this is definitely one task that I will not be contracting out. My experience shows that my car usually has problems when someone else touches it--I don't like people messing with my car. If I mess it up, I know who did it. The great part about me messing it up myself...I can usually figure out why I messed it up instead of wondering what those freakin' idiots did at the garage and now my car won't run!!!

I can't believe that I know THAT much more than you guys--maybe I do, who knows. I am not being cocky here. What are you guys, scared? Did you tune your AFC yourself? What makes you think you can't tune a standalone? It is not rocket science.