H1c-E85-27psi only 341hp

[nfernotalon]

Just got back from the dyno kind of disappointed. Only got 341hp at 27psi on e85. I thought it would be over 400 at 27. Seems low to me.

 

[habitatguy187]

Cams!

Can you post up a dyno graph? What were your afrs and timing like?

 

[nfernotalon]

Yea I'll post it up. Tomorrow though it was hot and I'm tired . Cams do sound like a good idea. Could the BEP bolt on housing be choking it that much already?

 

[jpmxrider489]

The bolt on housing is restrictive on high rpms. It tends to choke out. Cams would be a good upgrade maybe a set of 272.

 

[rr06rs]

Which compressor wheel?, was the turbo rebuilt prior to installing?

 

[nfernotalon]

Which compressor wheel?, was the turbo rebuilt prior to installing?

It was not rebuilt bought it as a core and put BEP housing on. Just got back from the track too the best I could do was a 14.1 disappointed again. It's the h1c with the 4pm intake but no grooves cutout on the housing.

Would it be worth it to switch to a t3 housing or just go up to an hx40?

 

[rr06rs]

The housing isn't holding you back. I wouldn't have just thrown a used and abused diesal turbo on the car without freshening it up. I'd bet this is one issue. Also, when I said what wheel I meant what size inducer and exducer? Also 14sec could mean nothing more than poor driving. What did you TRAP??? FWIW, I trapped 132 with an h1c at 30psi with a 54mm wheel in a bolt on FP housing and manifold. This was with 93 and meth injection.

 

[bryanwheat]

The turbo is obviously working because it is making 27 psi. The fact that it isn't rebuilt has nothing to do with it. It is still moving air. I would bet that it is all in the tune.

 

[nfernotalon]

Yea I'm thinking it's not the turbo either but the tune. Those guys were monkeys they were telling me the stock compression on on the 1gs was 9.1. Should of walked away right there I know. Turbo spools up good and has the same play since the day I got it I ran 25 on it everyday. I'll post up a 3rd gear pull tomorrow. I was only trapping 80 with a good launch building about 15 psi hell all the cars I ran I got right off the launch.

 

[JusMX141]

I'd like to know your peak timing number and peak airflow as well at that boost level as well. Something's not right here.

Correctly-calibrated airflow *should* be around 47-48 lb/min at that boost level. Here's proof that it's not the turbo:

I trapped 132 with an h1c at 30psi with a 54mm wheel in a bolt on FP housing and manifold. This was with 93 and meth injection.

 

[Greedy Pimp]

If your running close to 45 lbs off that turbo, thoes injectors are cutting it close, you should go bigger like 2100 and get some cams like kelferd 272, very good cams and price friendly. My mhi evo 16g does about 41 lbs and injectors are at like 82-85% (1150FIC) around 7500-8000 rpm and 23 lbs of boost, e85 of course. Do you have any other mods that you havent put on your profile? like a fpr?

 

[rr06rs]

The turbo is obviously working because it is making 27 psi. The fact that it isn't rebuilt has nothing to do with it. It is still moving air. I would bet that it is all in the tune.

I agree that its 95% in the tune. I think my post was really more personal opinion than anything. I just hate seeing people try to throw a 200+ mile junkyard diesal turbo on their car and wonder why its not making 500whp out the gate. To me, that's like taking your car to the track or dyno for the first time without doing the preventative maintenance like plugs, oil and fuel filters, etc. Like others said, tune is where I'd look. Also, when u said you were trapping 80, u meant 1/8th mile, right? I'm just confused ### you said your et was 14 which I assume is 1/4 mile? What did you trap in the 1/4???

 

[biglady112]

I cannot speculate too much as I have never seen the car and don't know a thing about it, but I was at Bandimere yesterday and I will say this.

The car performed very poorly. It never really sounded very good every time I saw it wether driving it through the pits, running it down the track, what have you. And from my vantage point it was not making any power. It just seemed very sluggish and anemic.

I know it hurts to hear that, but we went 13.6 at Bandimere in a full weight 2G with a small 16g in 2004 before we even knew what dsmlink was. That was even without an AFC.

Maybe it would be wise to share some datalogs. And depending on where you dynoed the car, that could be as low as 275hp uncorrected. With that low of numbers, it is no wonder the car was slow.

Where did you have it on the dyno? Who has done or did the tuning? Simple question, but are there any boost leaks? Are either of the wheels of the turbo chewed up?

 

[turboglenn]

ONe thing that's easy to overlook is base timing.. I had not reset mine after the last headgasket job and adjusting the intake cam back retarded 4* and when i drove the car it felt ok, but extremely sluggish.. I didn't check it due to pain i was in from swapping the gasket being that i'm still suffering from some srious injuries sustained in a motorcycle accident. Anyway.. Just assuming it was "close" i drove the car, kept boost low and watched the knock sensor and although everything seemed ok, the car was being a dog. Just yesterday i checked it and i was running at about 8* ATDC when i should have been at 10* BTDC (where my base timing is set for MY ECU) After setting it up the car gained masssive power everywhere..

The one area that never felt too bad even with retarded timing was cruising, idle and the first few PSI of boost, and that's becayse there's so much timing in those areas that even with 8* taken out there was still plenty there to make good power and get decent economy

might wanna check the base timing according to the DSMlink manual/instructions

also,post that logyou promised us

 

[bastarddsm]

Like everyone else said, Timing timing timing! You ought to be at about 12-14 when you hit full boost and ramp it up to 17+ at maxrpm.

 

[nfernotalon]

Like everyone else said, Timing timing timing! You ought to be at about 12-14 when you hit full boost and ramp it up to 17+ at maxrpm.

Here is the log guys I should of done right away.

If your running close to 45 lbs off that turbo, thoes injectors are cutting it close, you should go bigger like 2100 and get some cams like kelferd 272, very good cams and price friendly. My mhi evo 16g does about 41 lbs and injectors are at like 82-85% (1150FIC) around 7500-8000 rpm and 23 lbs of boost, e85 of course. Do you have any other mods that you havent put on your profile? like a fpr?

I do have an AFPR set to 37 unless they messed with it.

I agree that its 95% in the tune. I think my post was really more personal opinion than anything. I just hate seeing people try to throw a 200+ mile junkyard diesal turbo on their car and wonder why its not making 500whp out the gate. To me, that's like taking your car to the track or dyno for the first time without doing the preventative maintenance like plugs, oil and fuel filters, etc. Like others said, tune is where I'd look. Also, when u said you were trapping 80, u meant 1/8th mile, right? I'm just confused ### you said your et was 14 which I assume is 1/4 mile? What did you trap in the 1/4???

I agree with starting with a fresh turbo but it has minimal shaft play and is getting fed 75psi at redline and about 15psi at idle the turbo isnt the problem i think.

I cannot speculate too much as I have never seen the car and don't know a thing about it, but I was at Bandimere yesterday and I will say this.

The car performed very poorly. It never really sounded very good every time I saw it wether driving it through the pits, running it down the track, what have you. And from my vantage point it was not making any power. It just seemed very sluggish and anemic.

I know it hurts to hear that, but we went 13.6 at Bandimere in a full weight 2G with a small 16g in 2004 before we even knew what dsmlink was. That was even without an AFC.

Maybe it would be wise to share some datalogs. And depending on where you dynoed the car, that could be as low as 275hp uncorrected. With that low of numbers, it is no wonder the car was slow.

Where did you have it on the dyno? Who has done or did the tuning? Simple question, but are there any boost leaks? Are either of the wheels of the turbo chewed up?

It doesnt hurt to hear it hurt when it put down that hp at 27psi . You should of went up to me and told me my car was running like crap although I knew that already. I went to trenz it was my only chance to tune it before sunday Mac had a 2 week wait which is where I wanted to go in the first place. Not sure who tuned it, the wheels are perfect nothing chewed up or excessive shaft play.

ONe thing that's easy to overlook is base timing.. I had not reset mine after the last headgasket job and adjusting the intake cam back retarded 4* and when i drove the car it felt ok, but extremely sluggish.. I didn't check it due to pain i was in from swapping the gasket being that i'm still suffering from some srious injuries sustained in a motorcycle accident. Anyway.. Just assuming it was "close" i drove the car, kept boost low and watched the knock sensor and although everything seemed ok, the car was being a dog. Just yesterday i checked it and i was running at about 8* ATDC when i should have been at 10* BTDC (where my base timing is set for MY ECU) After setting it up the car gained masssive power everywhere..

The one area that never felt too bad even with retarded timing was cruising, idle and the first few PSI of boost, and that's becayse there's so much timing in those areas that even with 8* taken out there was still plenty there to make good power and get decent economy

might wanna check the base timing according to the DSMlink manual/instructions

also,post that logyou promised us

Base timing i had it set at 5 BTDC I think the guy that was tuning it said he moved it to 8. Im going to double check in a sec.

Here is my best time and dyno sheet.

 

[7"exhaust_tip]

37 deg of timing adv?

 

[nfernotalon]

37 deg of timing adv?

Ya WTF??

 

[turboglenn]

zero out the timing sliders. the min and maxctanetables look ok,but adding 13* oftiming on top of it is asking to break something. oTher than that the fueling is rich as hell (assuming the tables are all calibrated to hit the target AFR"s)

But either way the timing sliders need to be all zero'd out!

 

[nfernotalon]

Just did I'm gonna do a pull with the sliders zeroed out and watch knock.

It's cutting out like crazy now. Won't let me rev past 4k cuts out and exhaust pops like crazy .

 

[biglady112]

Wow. After looking at your datalog, whoever tuned it has no clue on how to use dsmlink. The thing is all over the place. They pretty much messes with everything they could mess with. The tune compounds and conflicts itself in so many ways no wonder the car ran like it did at the track. It is a shame you had to pay for something like that. What a waste.

 

[nfernotalon]

So heres what I noticed. It cuts out less and less the more timing I give it. What's going on.

 

[dsmtalon2008]

Did you verify base timing yet?

 

[JusMX141]

Something's definitely wrong- airflow never goes about 40.3 lb/min which is WAY off for 27psi from that turbo. Timing is a disaster- double-check base timing and start from scratch with the timing zeroed out like everyone's saying. You'll probably make more power doing that alone.

Now I'm a tuning novice without a doubt- but is there any reason you have global set for +/- 950cc injectors when you're actually using 1200's?

 

[nfernotalon]

Did you verify base timing yet?

Doing it now