Setting up GM maft on my car/ need a little help

[Black_Bullet]

Ok first off Ive recently purchased a GM maft setup and I am trying to set it up on my car.
I am not trying to tune with the maft, I have a eprom chip controlling everything so the maf will be zero'd out. I am coming from the 2g mas.

The maf translator that I have is a hack job, because the guy who had it before me was trying to do the cheapo wiring extension to allow it to sit in the glove box but the wiring was so F'ed up with different colors spliced on and no harness plug for the stock maf plug to plug into that I decied not to try to confuse myself with his mess and I just ordered the 2g Maf harness extension from machV http://us.st12.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/machv_2001_148642152 also so I can sit it in the glove box the right way.

Ok well the black plug in that picture in the link is the side I plugged into my 2g plug harness. ( I have the 2g plug spliced into my 1g harness since I used to run 2g mas.)

Now, I cut off the white plug in the links picture and the 5 wires left hanging from it were identical with the colors of the wires coming out of the maf translator, so i was thinking MachV would just make the wires the same color for simplicity, I just spliced the wires from the cut end of the extension harness onto the Maf-T wires color for color.

The three remaining wires coming out of the translator were attached to the small plug that goes into the GM maf itself. ( A black, a yellow, and pink. ) I didnt do anything with the white wire ( rpm) or purple. I dont believe i will need them even though later on Ill hook up the rpm wire anyways.

Well when I tried to start the car with everything plugged in and setup, the car immediately began idleing funny, hunting up and down from 1k to 3k ( idle suppose to be 900rpms.) and then I smelled fuel, and my check engine light came on seconds later.
My CEL is never on when I just have the 2g mas on there.
My friend Aaron runs a maf in his built 1g and he knows how to tune with them and set it up and everything with the translators dials. The red light flashed when he was trying to set it, and the green light blinked like once when we first tryed to turn it on and then turned off and stayed off ( Not right ?)

The conclusions Ive came up with is-
1.) I completely wired it wrong,
2.) I completely wired it wrong and/or the translator or maf is crap.

So for today I just put the intake pipe and 2g maf back on and just left the gm maf were it was on the UICP and drove it like that to work since I cant have the car down....

So could anyone help me with the wiring, Ive searched thru a few threads and what not on how the wiring is suppose to be and what each color is for, but since my wires were so fudged with no plugs to begin with I dont know which goes to what plug, especially since there are two blacks, and two pinks. I may end up just going thru the process of elimination. I need to keep the MachV extension harness as a bridge as I dont want to cut into my stock mas harness wiring or chop off the plug, so I can make this gm maf setup reversable like I have done in case I dont want to continue with it.

Thanks....

 

[tunethis]

You probably wired it wrong. I recently hardwired a maft into my 1g harness. I also came from a 2g mas. However, I didn't have to hardwire the GM Maf since I had the plug coming from the maft. You will only hook up 5 of the 7 wires coming from the 1g harness. Just tape or cap off the 2 unused wires. Be sure to set the dip switches to the correct positions before starting the car. Also, "zero" out all the dials since you aren't tuning with the maft. Make sure you connect the red wire from the harness to the pink wire on the maft (12 volts). You will not need to hook up the purple wire or white wire coming from the maft. Check out the links below for more help.

Use this for the 1g mas harness colors.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/242183-1g-2g-maf-upgrade-chart.html

Maft version 2.00+ instructions/tuning guide
MAFT Version 2.0+ Tuning Guide - Full Throttle Speed Tech Support

Maft version 1.3 instructions/tuning guide
MAFT instructions, version 1.3 OLD VERSION - Full Throttle Speed Tech Support

 

[Black_Bullet]

You probably wired it wrong. I recently hardwired a maft into my 1g harness. I also came from a 2g mas. However, I didn't have to hardwire the GM Maf since I had the plug coming from the maft. You will only hook up 5 of the 7 wires coming from the 1g harness. Just tape or cap off the 2 unused wires. Be sure to set the dip switches to the correct positions before starting the car. Also, "zero" out all the dials since you aren't tuning with the maft. Make sure you connect the red wire from the harness to the pink wire on the maft (12 volts). You will not need to hook up the purple wire or white wire coming from the maft. Check out the links below for more help.

Use this for the 1g mas harness colors.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/242183-1g-2g-maf-upgrade-chart.html

Maft version 2.00+ instructions/tuning guide
MAFT Version 2.0+ Tuning Guide - Full Throttle Speed Tech Support

Maft version 1.3 instructions/tuning guide
MAFT instructions, version 1.3 OLD VERSION - Full Throttle Speed Tech Support

Ok thanks for the response.

The translator should already be set correctly on the dials. Ive made it that far, i know it only needs 5 of the wires, and that I dont need the white or purple, but when I do install the white ( rpm) im going to put it to the cas.

Would it matter if I mixed up the two pink wires and/or the two black wires (ground) coming out the translator?
( Since there was no plugs I dont know which pink or which black goes to which plug.)
Im initially thinking thats what i did wrong.

Besides that, the only thing unique about my setup that may bring some question to my mind is that I run the N/T fuel pressure reg. which gives a 47.6psi base.

Therefore would I really be still setting the translator to stock injectors with a not stock fuel pressure?
(48psi base makes 450s flow 505cc btw)

Or does that not matter since my chip handles the inj compensaiton. ( I run 850s ) And since i run the 2g mas, and it is compensated for correctly in my chip tune, that means Im also suppose to set the translator to how a stock 2g would be set correct?

Im thinking with it zero'd out , it shouldnt affect the chip tunes settings ?

 

[tunethis]

Ok thanks for the response.

The translator should already be set correctly on the dials. Ive made it that far, i know it only needs 5 of the wires, and that I dont need the white or purple, but when I do install the white ( rpm) im going to put it to the cas.

Would it matter if I mixed up the two pink wires and/or the two black wires (ground) coming out the translator?
( Since there was no plugs I dont know which pink or which black goes to which plug.)
Im initially thinking thats what i did wrong.

I'm not sure about the double pink and double black wires but, they both do the same thing (12+v and ground).

Besides that, the only thing unique about my setup that may bring some question to my mind is that I run the N/T fuel pressure reg. which gives a 47.6psi base.

Therefore would I really be still setting the translator to stock injectors with a not stock fuel pressure?
(48psi base makes 450s flow 505cc btw)

I'm not sure about this. But, I'm sure it affects you somehow. I don't think that alone is why you car doesn't run right. I'm still with the stock 450's and I'm running a Walbro 255 and a stock fpr. I'm sure my fuel pressure is pretty high but my car idles fine and pulls pretty good. It still needs work after 6k but it's good enough until I tune it better.

Or does that not matter since my chip handles the inj compensaiton. ( I run 850s ) And since i run the 2g mas, and it is compensated for correctly in my chip tune, that means Im also suppose to set the translator to how a stock 2g would be set correct?

I read somewhere about setting the maft for a 2g if a chip is compansating for a 2g mas.

Im thinking with it zero'd out , it shouldnt affect the chip tunes settings?

It shouldn't but, a logger will let you know. I know people say to zero it out since the chip compansates for the fuel. But, when I zero out my maft with the stock injectors, I run super rich and I have to tune with it. The stock ecu compansates for the 450's but I still have to tune with the maft. I'm still learning though.?

....

 

[Black_Bullet]

Ok thanks. If both pink and both black wires do the same thing then it shouldnt matter which plug it ended up going to right?

Can you take me some pics of your translator wiring into your harness perhaps?

If thats the case i must have a bad translator, or something else unforseen .
I will have a day off tommorow so I have time to look at it then, Ill keep you posted.
Hopefully Ill figure it out by then, id really like to wrap this up quickly, I dont like taking too
long to do anything that should be simple .

 

[tunethis]

I'll see if I can get some pics now. It's dark so, they may suck. I will write down the colors from the harness to the maft as well.

 

[Black_Bullet]

I'll see if I can get some pics now. It's dark so, they may suck. I will write down the colors from the harness to the maft as well.

Cool thanks!

As much as I know about Dsm, this is my first time ever dealing w/ the maf first hand
and mines was such a mess when I got it that I didnt know were to start. But im pretty sure im at least close with the wiring or the car wouldnt have even started and idled like it did, though it was idling crappy and throwing a CEL.

Yea just throw up your pics and i know the gray, green, brown, go to the engine harness and that the yellow goes to the maf plug, just those two pinks and two blacks throwing me off; and I was basing my wiring off of machV's 2g maf extension harness since I just matched them up color for color but didnt actually consider that it may be incorrect to my actual harness.

 

[tunethis]

Okay. Apparently my cheap camera doesn't have focusing. So, I have no pics. Anyways, after looking inside the maft, I'm thinking the 2 black and 2 pink wires may need to be connected correctly. I looked at all my wires and noted how the are connected. It is as follows:

*NOTE: I have the early 1.3 version maft but, the wires inside should be the same color for the 2.00+ versions.

(Looking at the Maft with the wires coming out of the right side)

There's a total of 10 wires coming from the maft.

From top to bottom:

1. Purple - not used
2. Brown
3. Pink - to GM maf
4. Black - to GM maf
5. Yellow - to GM maf
6. Green
7. Black
8. Pink
9. White - not used
10. Grey


1g harness _______ Maft


Green/yellow >>>> Grey

Green/Orange >>>> Brown

Green/Blue >>>> Green

Green/Black >>>> Black

Red >>>> Pink

The best way to find the correct wires for the GM maf is to trace them all the way from the maft itself. The first pink and black wires and the only yellow wire coming from the maft (from top to bottom) goes to the GM maf.

 

[chavez408]

oh god it makes me not want one.

 

[tunethis]

oh god it makes me not want one.

I just got mine two weeks ago and had to hardwire it because my car had a 2g mas and I couldn't find a turbo 1g mas plug. I did some research and went for it. I didn't have any problems at start up. I bought my maft because the previous owner of my eclipse had the 2g mas installed without any tuning devices. I bought a logger setup and saw that my fuel trims were at 137% across the board. I was tired of running my car like that. I wanted something cheap to tune with and I wanted to get rid of the cramed-in 2g mas intake setup.

 

[Black_Bullet]

It shouldn't but, a logger will let you know. I know people say to zero it out since the chip compansates for the fuel. But, when I zero out my maft with the stock injectors, I run super rich and I have to tune with it. The stock ecu compansates for the 450's but I still have to tune with the maft. I'm still learning though.?

Ok thanks, tunethis your post helped.

I went over all the wiring and found that I had done it all correctly the first time and what was wrong was one of the grounds wasnt connecting correctly, the spliced wire came loose.

I solved it and got the car running and driveable
but though its working im running rich right now. I havent logged or checked fuel trims yet though.
The maf is zero'd out and set for 2g mas and 450s .

Something that may be possible is my higher fuel pressure causing the richness, though the chip is compensated for it with injector size? ( 48psi n/t fuel pressure )

Problem is I dont have a wide band, so I cant really tell, i can only hope/ guess that the chip is setting the fuel in the correct places, in which its close because when i dynoed last, the dynos wideband showed i was at 10.8 which isnt too far from the 11.0 set in the chip.

My afr should be about 11.0 at wot but its definitly going richer than that, the car is breaking up in the higher rpms which its never done before, and Im positive its because fuel, the plugs are fouling a lil bit. Its not really knocking bad though because my knock buzzer isnt going off at wot so I really doubt leanness.



Can anyone help me with why the car is running so rich now with the maf?

 

[chavez408]

Is it possible to run a gm maf and a translator and zero it out? I don't want one for tuning. I already got a wideband, link, eprom. I don't need another headache. I would just use it for more airflow, less restricted in the intake, and the bov goes pphhuusss.

 

[Black_Bullet]

Ok guys in my last post I was talking about how the car was running pig rich after I finnaly got the Maft setup up and running.

Well I did some logs and was getting 80 % fuel trims in all areas and im sure my AFR was in the 9s with the way it was running.

Then I finaly got around to boost leak testing it again for the 3rd time and sure enough one of the couplers to the back side of the maft had a leak. ( Air was already registered.)

So I had to redo the angle of my pipes because it kept blowing off when I boost leak tested it because it was at a crooked angle due to how I cut it.
I made sure to tighten down the tbolt clamps as far as they would go and I even put that sticky gasket spray stuff on the pipes so the coupler would have some more adhesive to stick.

Boost test held and the car was running fine again. Fuel trims back up in the high 90s ( a tad richer than Id like ) and the car was pulling hard again. It absolutely needs a quick retune, I can burn another chip for it tommorow, with leaner afrs, but it is close enough for now though.

** Differences over the maft vs my 2g-

Much more space to work with under the engine bay ( always a plus)

MUCH louder spool up and much louder blow off sound. I am venting for the 1st time EVER
( I am scaring ppl driving next to me. I feel like a ricer )

The car seems a bit smoother as it climbs rpms, and I notice a tad more top end
pull out of the car with anything over 20psi vs the way the 2g mas felt.
The gains were not very noticeable with boost under 17psi but when I put it to 21 it held it rock solid to redline which is a first. ( Used to always fall to 19-20 at 7k even with it up to 24-25lbs??)

I will aim for a 24psi 93 octane tune with up to 19degs timing advance by redline once I get these AFR's back in check.

I put a 2.5 in intercooler pipe for the intake. I just need to weld a nipple on it for the valve cover breather.
Hope it isnt too small, I doubt it though since the turbo is only like 2.25 " D.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[Black_Bullet]

Is it possible to run a gm maf and a translator and zero it out? I don't want one for tuning. I already got a wideband, link, eprom. I don't need another headache. I would just use it for more airflow, less restricted in the intake, and the bov goes pphhuusss.

Yea man, mines is zero'd out right now. My entire tune is thru the chip, and I plan to keep it that way. I dont feel to confident with tuning the maft honestly, but if I have to make tiny adjustments to help dial everything in then so be it.

 

[chavez408]

So what are you running gm maft and a translator? Where you there this from? Not many vendors carry them.

 

[Black_Bullet]

So what are you running gm maft and a translator? Where you there this from? Not many vendors carry them.

I got the maf from someone on DSMtalk on the classifieds, and I got the translator from a a local dsmer.

You have to run a translator to run the maf, that is how it operates it on our cars.
Our cars stock use the karman vortex air metering style, the maf's use a hot wire, the translator pretty much converts the signal into maf language i guess you can say.

The car is running pretty clean, I just have to do some tuning this weekend, my fuel trims are still all rich, and WOT afr is a tad too rich also, but nothing I cant fix. The spool up and the blow off noise is crazy, especially since my car is open DP with the cutout open.

*** Not like nobodys never seen a Maft setup before, but I have more pics so figured Id post em up. These are in the day time though.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[Black_Bullet]

Ive noticed that when cruising on the highway my o2 stops cyclying and goes to open loop at anything above 55mphs.

With the 2g mas and my extended closed loop feature in my chip I could hold my closed loop fuel operation until about 85-90mphs for better mpg.
Honestly I average a steady cruise of about 80-85mph on highway; so thats why its important to me.

I didnt change any settings yet in my chip, why would the maft kick the car out of closed loop sooner?
The fuel trims are all still rich, could the overall richness be causing it to go to open loop sooner.

Funny thing is, I drive about 50 miles a day going to and from work and I havent noticed any difference in gas consumption even with it running rich like this.

Think Im going to just lean everything out a bit on my chip and see if that helps and if not then ill have to adjust the maf a tad. ( Hope not, Id rather leave everything zero'd out.)
Though I do have one of those dinky autometer air fuel ratio gauges with the flashing lights, this would be soo much easier if I had a wideband, i have to tune fuel off of sense.

 

[tunethis]

I'm glad you fixed the problem. I've been away from the computer for a few days. If you can't get your trims any better after the chip burn, you may have to adjust the maft slightly. At first, I was always adjusting the dials because my hi trim was always max rich. The other trims weren't bad but no matter how much I leaned out things, the hi trim would stay rich. Since the the hi trim really only matters during crusing and I am knock free, I just left the maft alone. With just the maft, my car runs better than ever. It's very smooth and I love the louder spool up. Just like you, I did't notice any mpg differences even though I'm running so rich. Once I get a afpr, I should get a better tune from the maft.

 

[tunethis]

So what are you running gm maft and a translator? Where you there this from? Not many vendors carry them.

Check on the classifieds here or on ebay. Sometimes people sell the whole setup: GM maf + Maft, pipes, couplers, clamps, etc. You can also pull the GM maf from car at your local salvage yard. Using the search feature, you can find a list of compatable gm cars. They are very easy to remove using only a screwdriver.

 

[Black_Bullet]

I'm glad you fixed the problem. I've been away from the computer for a few days. If you can't get your trims any better after the chip burn, you may have to adjust the maft slightly. At first, I was always adjusting the dials because my hi trim was always max rich. The other trims weren't bad but no matter how much I leaned out things, the hi trim would stay rich. Since the the hi trim really only matters during crusing and I am knock free, I just left the maft alone. With just the maft, my car runs better than ever. It's very smooth and I love the louder spool up. Just like you, I did't notice any mpg differences even though I'm running so rich. Once I get a afpr, I should get a better tune from the maft.

Yea I need a wideband badly.

I did a log though and my lowest fuel trim was 110% and the other two were 81%.
Thats pretty rich, i may end up messing with the maf, but just slightly, id like for them all to be around 110%, but im trying to keep most of the tune done on the chip. I havent heard too many good things about tuning the translator itself.

I wonder if the car isnt really leaving closed loop, maybe its just burning so rich i am percieving it as that way. Idk

 

[tunethis]

Yea I need a wideband badly.

I did a log though and my lowest fuel trim was 110% and the other two were 81%.
Thats pretty rich, i may end up messing with the maf, but just slightly, id like for them all to be around 110%, but im trying to keep most of the tune done on the chip. I havent heard too many good things about tuning the translator itself.

I wonder if the car isnt really leaving closed loop, maybe its just burning so rich i am percieving it as that way. Idk

I don't know either. Yeah, I need a wideband as well. My hi trim is at 81%, mid is 89-92%, and low is 98-106%. When I reset the computer, all of them start at 100% but within 30 minutes the hi trim falls down all the way. I try to lean it out but it continues to fall to 81%. I stopped worrying about it for now. I know you want the chip to do the work but, your base knob may need to be turned a click or two to lean everything out a little. Then, the idle knob will need to be turned to richen the low trim up. It will get leaner when you turn the base knob. I guess the tune is off since the computer sees a lot more air coming in via the GM maf. Zeroing out the knobs is what people say to do with a chip but I guess that's not always the case. Also, the maft seems pretty sensitive. If something isn't right, like if there's a boost leak, the tune will be off.

 

[Black_Bullet]

I don't know either. Yeah, I need a wideband as well. My hi trim is at 81%, mid is 89-92%, and low is 98-106%. When I reset the computer, all of them start at 100% but within 30 minutes the hi trim falls down all the way. I try to lean it out but it continues to fall to 81%. I stopped worrying about it for now. I know you want the chip to do the work but, your base knob may need to be turned a click or two to lean everything out a little. Then, the idle knob will need to be turned to richen the low trim up. It will get leaner when you turn the base knob. I guess the tune is off since the computer sees a lot more air coming in via the GM maf. Zeroing out the knobs is what people say to do with a chip but I guess that's not always the case. Also, the maft seems pretty sensitive. If something isn't right, like if there's a boost leak, the tune will be off.

Ok i will try that tommorow. I need to do something because I do way too much driving to and from work to be wasting gas .

Tune will be off w/ a boost leak before or after maft? I thought one of the main reasons switching to blow thru setup is to not have boost leaks affect you before maft since it reads air after 90% of the rat maze of intercooler pipings.

But, I do have a little annoying leak at my tb shaft seals which is after maft....
Will need to fix that soon, and also fix my boost leak at the forge bov ( w/ another valve)
because it doesnt seat right and lifts up and looses pressure at anything over 20psi.
Other than that I dont have much problems w/ boost leaks.

Your fuel trims dont seem too far from mines, wish you had a wideband to know what exact afr that is for your trims.

Theres still a lot of power left in my setup, I see 19degs of timing at 7k with 24psi falling to 21 by redline right now ( on a chip set 11.3 afr which im sure is really richer than that)
and the car pulls good w/ this maft setup over the 2g mas and I logged like 1 count of knock on my pulls.... Im satisfied w/ my boost/timing on 93 octane but i think im going to just keep leaning everytihng out until I see some concernable knock, then richen it back up to the peak point before the knock.... Think thats the best way to go without a W.B.O.

 

[Black_Bullet]

Possibly relevant.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tun.../249894-added-gm-maft-uicp-car-wont-idle.html


The guys in that thread are saying there car was running leaner when the o2 stopped cycling due to the gm maft.... Id say I was running richer.

Im considering hooking up the rpm wire tommorow and trying to run it in rpm mode
I have heard that the car runs better/ more consistent.

Guess I need to log o2 sensor next. O2 Sensor FAQ

 

[44pirate]

Do you have a fuel pressure regulator. If the feul pump is overunning the FPR then your HI trim will show this, rich.

 

[Black_Bullet]

Do you have a fuel pressure regulator. If the feul pump is overunning the FPR then your HI trim will show this, rich.

I run the non turbo FPR which raises 1:1 and gives a base fuel pressure of 47.6psi
thus requiring larger injcetor compensation for the added flow.
Most setups ive researched when they have 255lphs and stock regulators, they overrun to about 48psi... If my theory is correct that means my car should have less overrun since my base fuel pressure starts at about what most cars over run to, not that im not doubting there isnt any overrun, im sure there is, maybe just as bad.
Some may disagree, but Ihavent found any information otherwise that would suggest my theory is wrong.