Nitrous education?

[v8s_are_slow]

Thinking about Nitrous and I've forgotten a lot about what I've read in the past. Can't remember the difference between the wet and direct port. Direct Port is where there's a line going to each intake runner correct? If I get a kit, I want the safest kit because blowing my motor really isn't in my plans. Forget what a wet kit is.

Is one brand better than another? Would a tps switch be better than a switch at the throttle? I'm wondering about using a stutterbox at the line. Don't want it going off while sitting at the line revving it ya know? There's only 1/8th mile track around so not a very long distance. Best gears to use it?

I don't care about an electric bottle opener cause I'll ONLY be using it at the track. Anything else I'd need to know about for using it? Sites to read? Thanks.

 

[greddyturbo19]

if you do do NOS make sure you have a purge. i had NOS in my non turbo eclipse and i didnt have Purge and when i hit the button BOOOOOMM my intake and filter blew off the car to the other side of the road and messed up alot of sensors. so yea. and i have also been told never use a wet kit?? thats what i had so yea i would do direct port which does go into each intake. and looks sweet.

 

[1992awdlaser]

Yes, a direct port one has a nozzle on each intake runner. A wet kit will just have a single nozzle in the intercooler pipe. I like direct port kits better personally. In order to run a direct port you would need to buy an intake manifold that has nitrous bungs welded in or tap your intake for the nozzles. If you go with a direct port kit I would reccomend a zex kit since they come with flexible lines for the intake runners. All the other kits as far as I know come with hard lines that you have to bend.

edit: The wet kit will have nitrous and fuel going into the intercooler pipe. A dry kit will only have nitrous going in. The direct port kit will have both nitrous and fuel entering at the runners of the intake manifold.

 

[greddyturbo19]

Yes, a direct port one has a nozzle on each intake runner. A wet kit will just have a single nozzle in the intercooler pipe. I like direct port kits better personally. In order to run a direct port you would need to buy an intake manifold that has nitrous bungs welded in or tap your intake for the nozzles. If you go with a direct port kit I would reccomend a zex kit since they come with flexible lines for the intake runners. All the other kits as far as I know come with hard lines that you have to bend.

edit: The wet kit will have nitrous and fuel going into the intercooler pipe. A dry kit will only have nitrous going in. The direct port kit will have both nitrous and fuel entering at the runners of the intake manifold.

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THIS DUDE!!!!!!!

 

[greddyturbo19]

FOUND THIS INFO ON Welcome! I DID NOT WRITE THIS

WET KIT

"This type of system will make the upper intake wet with fuel. These systems are best used with intakes designed for wet flow and turbo/supercharged applications. The reason for this is the fact that fuel flows differently than air or nitrous. This difference in flow characteristics can lead to distribution problems and, in some cases, intake backfires. Intakes designed for wet flow (such as with carburetors) cause much less separation of the nitrous/air, and fuel. Because modern fuel injection intakes are designed to flow air only, they have tighter turns and a more compact design as a result. Thus, they generally do not make good candidates for wet flow nitrous systems."

You will notice however, that I chose the Nitrous Works TB plate kit for my car, and MANY people have had great success with similar kits. NX (Nitrous Express) kits are another manufacturer I've been recommending more and more. See their link on my Links page.

Don't believe everything you read or every story you hear. Many nitrous mishaps are the result of some rookie trying to spray his motor with a 200 shot at idle. If you do something like that let me know so I can laugh and torment you endlessly. By the way, the new wet NOS Noszle kit looks neat, adding fuel and nitrous through little cups the injectors fit into, but last price i saw was $1300.00 from Summit Racing. Need I say more?

Dry kits:

Now, dry kits are another matter, I like the idea and simplicity, but at power levels over about 100hp I also get kinda nervous about leaning out, (especially with my 1993-2001 hypereutectic pistons) and NOS and Zex's method of dealing with it seems borderline acceptable. Rising the fuel pressure can only do so much, (they jump fuel pressure to around 80 PSI), it's VOLUME that I would rather see boosted (through an PCM interface or something, controlling the pulse of the injectors to richen the mixture.) A secondary injector set would be neat too, so it would be a sort of bastard nitrous setup, sorta wet, but no fuel in the upper intake. By the way, if you think your in-tank Walbro 190 or 255 lph fuel pump is adequate to run a 150 dry shot, you are WRONG! The fuel flow capacity of either of these pumps at 90 PSI drops down to about 33 lph!!!! You want to take that chance?


Dry kits are reliable and easy to install, but fuel injectors weren't designed to handle 90psi fuel pressure, and I think that method of enriching the fuel mixture (NOS FMU) is kinda mickey mouse. Wet kits that introduce fuel into the upper intake (Nitrous Express, Nitrous Works, CompuCar, Top Gun) run into the hazard mentioned above, and some require you to drill into your expensive aftermarket throttle body. You risk fuel puddling in the upper with either choice, which can lead to expensive explosions. Most guys do NOT have problems with these kits though, unless you try spraying off idle or in top gear with 2.73:1 rear gears at 50 mph. I am going to talk to Wilson Manifolds about their burst panels however, and see if they can be adapted over to the thick EFI Mustang upper intakes, for safety.

If you want to do it right, do an NOS Big Shot kit or a Top Gun plate kit (both utilize a plate between upper and lower intakes, eliminating the puddling problem.) Each will support around 300 hp and make spraying the car a little less intimidating.

Fogger kits are the ultimate in versatility and intimidation factor, not to mention horsepower. No chance of any puddling, each cylinder can be custom tailored for optimum fuel mixture (8 nozzles, 8 fuel jets, 8 nitrous jets), good to around 500hp, and vicious looking on any intake manifold. If you don't know what a fogger kit is go to nosnitrous.com and do some homework. =) The cons of foggers are:

**Very expensive, typically start at around $700 US.

**Time consuming to wire and install, lots of custom line plumbing involved.

**If you mess up drilling or tapping the intake you gotta have it welded back up before you can try again.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Alright, let's say I buy a Zex direct port kit, does it come with EVERYTHING I'd need? Or would I need other items as well?

 

[greddyturbo19]

Alright, let's say I buy a Zex direct port kit, does it come with EVERYTHING I'd need? Or would I need other items as well?

well the zex direct port kit comes with just about everything i am pretty sure it doesnt come with a purge kit. and that is a must to get out all the air out of the system. and it is also a very good idea to get a bottle warmer. NOS flows better

 

[v8s_are_slow]

K, I'll keep that in mind. Also, I have 1000cc injectors,Walbro 255 pump, dsmchip to compensate for the injectors, and maft. I have a wideband of course. Stock fpr for now. I'm sure the injectors are more than enough for the 50 trim I'm running. What a/f ratio would I need to be looking at? And no one mentioned what gears would be best to run. Although I appreciate the replies.

Greddyturbo19, that link didn't work for me

 

[greddyturbo19]

well i dont know about the whole air to fuel ratio stuff so i will let someone else answer that. but about the link just go to google.com and type in zex nitrous sytems and click the first link and check it out the direct port kit from them cost around 800 or less. and all the stuff you can get with it too.

 

[Killa_dsm]

I have installed a Wet ZEX kit into my buddies Civic Si and it works very nicely. The only thing I suggest getting is a bottle pressure gauge and bottle heater. In order to make sure your bottle is up to operational pressure.

A direct port nitrous system would be the best choice since you will have a even flow of nitrous into each cylinder. Unlike a wet or dry kit.

Then comes the wet kit, which injects both fuel and nitrous at the same time. A wet kit is a lot safer then running a dry kit because just injecting nitrous can make your motor run lean.

 

[1992awdlaser]

You will look for the same air/fuel ratio as without it. The air/fuel ratio sshould stay pretty close without any adjustments since the system adds both nitrous and fuel. You will need to turn the boost down a few psi when you get ready to start tuning the nitrous. This is because when spraying the exhaust gasses will be bigger and spool the turbo instantly and create a few more psi. So if you left the boost the same and spray it then you would build more boost than desired.

The Zex kit comes with everything you need. But there are other things that you could buy but don't need. The bottle warmer is a must in my oppinion. If the bottle isn't up to pressure when doing a run the car could run rich since the pressure won't be pushing as much nitrous in as if the bottle was up to pressure. But at the same time it will still be adding all the fuel as if the bottle was up to pressure. A blow down tube is mandatory at most tracks for tech inspection.

Any other question?

 

[jES(i)se]

another good thing to keep in mind that adding nitrous into a forced induction car is that the hp amounts generally listed for na setups are greatly increased. for example, if you used a jet rated at around 35hp, you will most likely see closer to 45-50hp out of it on a boosted car. it has alot to do with cooling the air intake temps as nitrous comes out very cold. its basically like a second huge ic on the car. thats another reason it works so good as an intercooler cooler with the intercooler rings you can get to drop ic temps. plus your compressing even more oxygen molecules than you would be on a boosted car without nitrous.

 

[1992awdlaser]

another good thing to keep in mind that adding nitrous into a forced induction car is that the hp amounts generally listed for na setups are greatly increased. for example, if you used a jet rated at around 35hp, you will most likely see closer to 45-50hp out of it on a boosted car. it has alot to do with cooling the air intake temps as nitrous comes out very cold. its basically like a second huge ic on the car. thats another reason it works so good as an intercooler cooler with the intercooler rings you can get to drop ic temps. plus your compressing even more oxygen molecules than you would be on a boosted car without nitrous.

True. I believe evil eagle used a 50 shot and gained 90hp a couple of seasons ago.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

So if my afr's are good, and I'm spraying with a direct port, AND I have a tps sensor to stop the nitrous when I'm not into the gas, are their any precautions I need to take so that I don't blow my motor to hell or did you guys pretty much cover it all?

 

[1992awdlaser]

When you first sttart tuning it I would also lower your timing.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Oh, and what about stutterbox settings with nitrous? Don't wanna be spraying while staging. Would it hurt to be spraying when launching in 1st gear?

 

[1992awdlaser]

Is your parts list up to date? I know with Dsmlink you can set the nitrous to not turn on until a certain mph. That way it won't be on at the line. You can launch while spraying but you don't want it to spray while you are sitting still at the line.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

It's up to date now

 

[1992awdlaser]

Yeah, I'm not sure how you would keep the nitrous from activating at the line. I figured you might have Dsmlink so that is why I put that info in. The only way with a stutterbox and not being able to set it to turn on above a certain mph that I can think of would be to have a switch and not turn the sytem on until after you launch.

 

[jES(i)se]

i've not had any experience with at stutterbox but if you're not holding the gas at wot on the line you can get a wot switch to control activation of nitrous. they make two different kinds. one kind just bolts onto the throttle body and when the throttle rotor goes all the way open it activates the n2o system. the other kind reads the tps sensor and works off voltage. you could use that in conjunction with a rpm based window switch so it comes on at a certain rpm.

basically it will be set up like this for wiring
1. switch inside to arm the system to..
2. wot to activate the system to..
3. window switch that turns the soleniod on and off between 2 set rpms.

this is how its set up on my avenger. i have my rpms set to activate at 2800 and off at 6200. i set it at 2800 because thats where my high stall converter is at to try and keep wheelspin to a minimum and then the 6200 is just a few rpms short of where it shifts so i can attempt to avoid any type of backfire or anything should it hit the rev limiter before it shifts at 6500.

although if the stutterbox is something thats a wot thing sitting on the line, none of this will work.

 

[1992awdlaser]

Yes, with a stuutterbox you are holding the car at wot at the line. The stutterbox is just a rev limiter for when the clutch is pushed in.

 

[Mr Peepers]

Thought I'd throw this into the mix:
http://www.grapeaperacing.com/GrapeApeRacing/tech/nitrousoxide.pdf

 

[jES(i)se]

i figured that was the case. well something else that i know of that should work is a time based nitrous controller like this one Nitrous Oxide Systems (NOS) 15838ANOS - NOS Time Delay Switches - summitracing.com that way you could launch off stutter and then the n2o will fire after you're moving. theres tons of different controllers like this if you look around i'm sure you could find something that would work

 

[kraka]

My friend runs a wet kit in his Evo (75 - 140 shot on pump)

He builds boost with the 2-step, launches and flips the switch after switching into 2nd. He uses a WOT switch so the nitrous starts spraying immediately at that point. It's a nice rush, and it pulls HARD!

Be warned though, he blew his motor from NLTS on the bottle. He would be spraying in between shifts and shoot out little pieces of his rods when he went from 2nd-3rd and 3rd - 4th.

 

[JOEY A]

My friend runs a wet kit in his Evo (75 - 140 shot on pump)

He builds boost with the 2-step, launches and flips the switch after switching into 2nd. He uses a WOT switch so the nitrous starts spraying immediately at that point. It's a nice rush, and it pulls HARD!

Be warned though, he blew his motor from NLTS on the bottle. He would be spraying in between shifts and shoot out little pieces of his rods when he went from 2nd-3rd and 3rd - 4th.

Maybe it should be running richer on the NLTS or somthing.....Maybe there was a lean point some were